Although I haven't been to a bike hop in quite some time, I'll throw in my two cents on this from my own perspective..

Bike hop was a vehicle for us to solve a major logistical problem with art-hop. Parking.

While I'll admit that the majority of bike hops I attended were booze fueled, that was never the focus.

The art was.

Well, as you could have guessed by the earlier posts, I usually would hit ArtHop via BikeHop.

and the funny thing about it all?

Nine times out of ten, by time we'd get to a place, there really wouldn't be a whole lot of hooch or munchies left.
(...that's one of the things that initially threw me about Ed's origional remark.)

-In a years worth of BikeHops (and we hit a lot of the ArtHop Stops, (usually at least ten to 15 per run,)
I think we've actually walked into a place where there was (still,) wine or beer there maybe on average once, (maybe) twice, or nonce per night. (no foolin')

God's honest truth,
-unless you brought your own 40, (and that's just so classy, lemme tell ya,) for us it usually is all about the art,
-because there really wasn't any other choice most of the time.
Most places are picked cleaner than a Turkey carcas four days after Thanksgiving.

Jinaka was kind of an anomaly in that it almost always had something cool to nibble on, and it was always beautifully presented and somehow seemed to be a part of the whole experience.
(Martha would have been proud.)
But usually? there (may be,) some wine, but not a whole ton,
and half the time we just wanted water
(folks would normally just duck into Tokyo and grab something there if they wanted something from the bar.)

Chris Sorenson is one who will try to kill you with food, (which I've always found to be extremely gracious, this is truly a warm and friendly crew, and he's one of the kinder souls I've met here in town,)
And some of the smaller galleries,
(spectrum, Ashtree, JavaWava, and the Hair Salon right next door to it,) have very elegant, yet sometimes downright 'homey,' atmospheres that are so rewarding to spend time in.

(the hair salon next to JavaWava felt like I was hanging in someone's kitchen nibbling on cheese and just catching up on life... REALLY nice folks there, and the setting really made an impression.)

I personally think this whole big 'progressive coctails of art,' is more legend than fact...
(at least from my experience over the past year.)

Not at all Mel. I agree with you. Unless you have an adult checking ID's (just like at a bar), you don't serve booze. Go see the art, meet the artists, network, THEN go to the bar for a few drinks to discuss what you saw. It's so flipping hot out this time of year I'd rather see water bottles than wine anyway.

Then again, that's a lot to do for us old people on a Thursday night haha. Crap it sucks getting old.

If serving booze at ArtHop has become a problem, stop serving booze. Am I being too logical?

This response and the string in general (to me,) brings up a lot of credible issues about BikeHop/ArtHop and gallery showing in general.

Rather than put up another long post on the thread?
I'm putting it up as a forum entry, (gimme a sec, and I'll throw in the link.)

okay, there ya go.

http://www.fresnofamous.com/node/6284

-OotV

OotV,
i do think you may have missed my point a little. of course i knew it was bike hoppers. it was fairly obvious due to the large amount of bikes parked outside, and all the people that were coming in, looking like they'd been riding. this was in no way a problem/issue/concern. hell, i'd rather have sweaty people come in and look @ the art than people come in calm and collected and not look @ the art. (as for the sweat, up until feb the bus & my bike were my main transports for the last 2 years, so i know all about sweating about the 'no.) and, since i understand the nature of art hop, whether or not you are biking, i know that you don't have all evening to stay at a particular venue unless it's superb. you go in, check it out, if you don't like it, you don't stay as long. this is how i operate as a viewer.

i was speaking about a singular incident where a large group came in and used the joint for its refreshments and little else. it didn't matter who the group was. furthermore, it wasn't even the point of what i was talking about. it was a small bit @ the end of a post. not a throwaway comment, but certainly not the thrust of the post. but since you felt maligned, i'll explain:

i'm all for hipsters going to shows. i'm all for yuppies going to shows. i'm all for hippies going to shows. i'm all for _____ going to shows. that gets people talking. that gets art growing and spreading in our fair city and beyond. in fact, i was really super pleased that the bike hoppers stopped by my june show. not only did i get to say hi to a few people i've connected with like kurtz and kevin, but also i hope a few people looked @ my art. i was glad to have a boast in my attendance when the rolled through.

as for this,"It may just be that folks didn't find the show that appealing, (sorry, but it is what it is,)
we probably walked in, gave it a fair shot, and appreciated the munchies none-the-less.)

Somehow THAT possibility never made it into Ed's description of things. "
you're wrong. although it wasn't listed in my earlier post, that possibility was considered @ the time it happened. there are tons of other possibilities that i didn't list there to explain this incident, should i have listed them all? of course i consider whether on not people like what i'm putting out there. as an artist who is hoping to talk to people about his craft, whether or not i sell, i'm always checking out who is coming through the door, if they're looking about and so on. and you can call it what you want, but walking into a venue, directly to the wine, filling glasses and walking out, only looking around while waiting for wine, isn't really checking out the art. at least in my opinion. because this behavior was exhibited by a group of people, it stood out in my mind that night. now, mind you, i don't bear a grudge at all. really, i mentioned it in passing, not as a part of my main point. i am in no way harboring ill will towards any bike hoppers. it was an example of people not looking at the art. it happens all the time, with all sorts of groups, and i'm sure that most artists would appreciate if people who check out the work a little and then mill about to be seen/drink wine/jump rope/make phone calls. it happened, and frankly, i understand, sometimes all that people want @ a venue is just to get a cup of wine. you know the place, the owner, you know they're always good for it. such was the case with 637. now, did they glance @ the art? probably. now, i'm not great, but i'd like to think that to actually see my art, you need more than a brief glance as you walk by on the way in and out. you need to stand in front of a piece and consider it. if you don't like it, fine. but don't tell me you looked @ my show, that probably had 15 pieces in it in less than a minute (factor in getting wine/cheese/water and you're cutting your view time to 30-45 seconds. 3 seconds a piece, that's good viewing. okay, i realize i'm oversimplifying here.) okay, enough on this.

to restate my original point: i understand people come out to be seen. people in the doors is a good thing. it builds buzz. hopefully, buzz will eventually = $. but, please look @ the art while you mill around. the artist, however good she or he is, has themself invested in it. you don't have to stay long, but give it a fair look.

nah, I don't think so.

(but then again, disagreeing with you would be seen as further defensive, so, it's kind of moot.)

Long? Yeah my stuff can be long.
And believe me, that was no rant.

The point of it?

It's two parts, actually.

1. Another writer was complaining about 'scenesters,' 'taking away,' from the legitimate ArtHop experience.
-I explained that ArtHop being a scene, is part of the point of ArtHop. --It's supposed to get larger and take on a life of it's own, (and it has, and it includes people who are serious about 'Art,' as well as those who are just looking for something to do.)
--My point? That is what ArtHop is for, and saying it's somehow diminshed by scensters, trendies, hipsters, hamsters, or whatever, is elitest and completely incorrect.

2. The thing about Ed's remarks about 'a bunch of sweaty people on bikes, coming in and drinking stuff, and then leaving, (without stopping to consider his show...)

-I further explained the time limitations of BikeHop (which, I think Ed knew what that group was, (It is also quite likely that I was possibly in the group,) and feel it should be answered to as well. (again, I've been in most of them over the past twelve months, led a few, and know the disposition of the group,

(IF) they just walk in get some munchies, look around and decide to leave?
It's only after the whole bunch has had a chance to really look at what was there,
-Most BikeHops are good sized in attendance, by virtue of the nature of stopping for a site, they can't just get-and-jet.
-If it was a small 'hop (and I've led some of them,) again, we leave only after we're sure everybody has had a chance to decide if they want to be there or not -and then give each other plenty of time to say, 'okay, lets go.'
That's how Ben ran it, That's how I ran my two (or three?) and I know Tom would do the same thing. It is extremely 'group concious,' and venue sensitive Because we know our size and how we can impact a show simply by walking in.

(We all in the group know that we have different tastes, and I've never seen them be in a big hurry to just go ripping through anywhere.)

-Because of the varying tastes? It's a group that bends over backwards to be considerate of each persons viewing time,
-and often thanks,(repeatedly,) any venues that have food or drink for us.
-Because we often hit the same venues each month, (and mix it up a little here and there,) we know the venue operators, and they know us.

If the group was bike hop? and were at Ed's showing?

Considering how much time we take once at a place,
-as well as how much effort it takes to actually get to a place,

It may just be that folks didn't find the show that appealing, (sorry, but it is what it is,)
we probably walked in, gave it a fair shot, and appreciated the munchies none-the-less.)

Somehow THAT possibility never made it into Ed's description of things.

-and I'm not going to sit back and let one of the better events in Fresno, (ArtHop/BikeHop)
-as well as a group that acts so differently than the depiction, both knowing and being a part of their behavior,) be missrepresented.

Call it what you wish.

Ed has another show?
Depending on it's location, I'm sure BikeHop we'll be happy to look at it again, (by and large, the group is very supportive of area artists,
But they're far from just grubbing, guzzling, and gettin'.

That was a long, defensive rant just to totally miss edluv's point.

Your statement that "We're not there for the food and free drinks" is in complete contradiction to his one experience that he related about bikehop coming in, drinking wine and immediately leaving.

Did you miss that part?

I doubt edluv hates bikehop or any of the other groups that come through. But that one experience whether it was representative or not was still a bad one.

I chipped a tooth with a fork. Does that mean I hate forks? Does that mean I'll never use a fork again? No, but I can still tell people about how I chipped a tooth with a fork. Geez, settle down a bit.

Art Hop.

There is a funny dynamic to Art Hop and 'Art Scenes,' to begin with.

For openners?
Most Artists aren't wealthy, there are a few who have money set aside and who can focus on their art, and 'not sweat the green stuff,' but most of them are (usually,) part-timers who do their art, eventually think in terms of selling it, --and often have work that they're working on for sale, and some for personal progressive study.

--My friends, fellow artists, and I had a very real joke going, but it was true,,,
You have your personal angst ridden 'this is so me, this is so deep,' work,
--and then you had your stuff that was (surprisingly,) sofa-sized, and often had tonal values in the palate that were (surprisingly,) the same colors that were being used by a lot of the interior decorators and more 'current and in demand,'

-Was this selling out?
Nope... This was giving people what they wanted, and meant working with the public demand and taste, (and oddly enough? public taste is not always the same as the artists.)

In order for the Art Scene to work, (as a terrarium,)
You have those who create the stuff, -then those who are a part of that process, (other artists and musicians, or simply 'hang-arounds,'

-And then you have those who can afford to buy the stuff, (who can be from a totally different genre of the society.)

-And you ALWAYS want folks in general checking it out.

-How these groups hook up is to come out to such things as ArtHop, (which is a brilliant premise, by the way, and crosses a lot of borders comfortably.)

-I thought the idea of ArtHop was to get people in general down and milling around checking out the art, which means checking out the scene, and always means meeting up with each other?

The post that spoke of 'hipsters,' and 'people making the scene,' and 'not being really into the art' is a serious example of somebody who does not understand how the public interracts with art, and how artists interract with the public.
(...explain to me 'being really into the art,' too,,, what does somebody have to stand glued to the wall, have some sort of life-changing experience, embrace the work like a terrier on a trouser leg? or is a simple, '...cool...' good enough?)

First off:
Just because somebody creates something and hangs it on the wall, does NOT mean that everybody wants to, or has to, look at it and want to spend time with it.

-Yep, it's nice that someone made something, (and bravo for their having a show,)
---but you know what? if their stuff does nothing for me, I'm not going to sit there and say '...but I'm SUPPOSED to like it because it's ART...'

Nope, sorry, if someone does something that is eyecatching and interesting to me, I'll spend some time with it, and really support the artist (at least in conversation,) ---and might just one day be able to buy some of their stuff. (I am still saving up for freakin' ANYTHING by some area artists who I admire.)

But there is NO rule that you need to walk in, and spend a lot of time in front of something when you don't think it's worth it.

ArtHop allows people to do this without pretention.
It's designed to.
I've been in tons of ArtHops (I've only missed a couple of recent ones due to work sched,)
(and I've been on a bicycle, btw... we'll get into that in a minute,)

-but the whole idea of ArtHop is '...hey, lets get folks interested in local art, lets get them interested in LOCAL (period,)
-and lets create a scene for this night on a regular basis....

--The one post above made it sound like the EXACT thing that makes art-hop successful is the thing that also is cheapening it, and spelling out it's doom.
(That's just ignorant of what Art Hop is about.)

Also:
There are some places in ArtHop that have different definitions of what they are.

-I think I've actually been at Broadway Studios twice, where there were actually serious refreshments being served...
Most of the time there are none,
--and Broadway is a vital part of art in Fresno, (it is it's own scene, actually,)
-There is a huge mixing ground there, (not just younger or 'alt,' crowds going through,)
---and who knows? maybe stuff is sold, maybe it's not.
-But you will always find something intersting there, (It also has a huge concentration of artists in one place, ---some with very professional representation in their studios, -others waaaay more low-fi.

-But when you walk around Broadway, you will find yourself looking into a work space, looking around, and if you want to check it out further, you just do,
If not?, hey, no harm-no foul.
It's supposed to be a sort of bazaar with no strings attached.

There are other studios that are close together, and some places where I may poke a head in the door, but nine times out of ten I'm not going to see anything that will interest me. (I just don't care for the artists style, nice enough person I suppose, but their stuff doesn't do anything for me.)
(There IS one studio that I hit all the time, (despite not really caring for the work, usually,)
-but I go in there because it is an active studio and the air is heavy with linseed oil and turps...
(which to me is one of the most magnificent aroma's in this life, and reminds me of who I am as a person...)
-So, in it's own way, even that studio serves it's purpose.

There is nothing wrong with that.

BikeHop (which was those sweaty bikers you were referring to,) is, in a lot of ways the epitome of ArtHop.

-Though I am no longer in it so much,
I've been in nearly every one since last spring... love the concept, and it's a great bunch of people.

Art (Bike)Hop is a limited window of time to catch galleries and find out what is going on, art-wise.
-It tries to fulfill that mission by pedalling around
(and sorry Ed, when you pedal in Fresno? you're going to get a little sweaty, (not much, pedalling causes a breeze too, dontcha-know,)
-But this IS Fresno, and when you do ANYTHING in Fresno from May to October, you will sweat.
Don't worry though, fresh sweat doesn't stink, and I, for one, promise not to try to hug you, k?)

The timeframe of visiting a series of galleries in BikeHop is limited.
Why?
We are pedalling from Club Fred's area up to Fresno High, often all the way down to Chris Sorensons, and then back up to Tokyo or Broadway (and then back to VanNess Village Courtyard,) --and need to be brief at most stops. (It can be a major run.)

Because it's a group event, and because people have different tastes, it's very likely that, if there is NOT mass appeal?,
(or not a large cluster of galleries together?)
-you will find cyclists coming in in a group,
checking out what is there,
and moving on faster than other 'Hoppers,
(--we are never really sure when the train is going to pick up and get moving,)
--and we want to see everybody's stuff and give them a chance.
-We can't help but be noticiable, but every gallery docent or owner that we've met has been glad to see us, and we them, and smiles at the idea of 'BikeHop.'
-Well, I guess, except you.

Despite your telling of 'sweaty possible bike people coming in, heading to the drinks, and then immediately leaving..'

What usually is the norm?
-Nine times out of ten, by time BikeHop makes it to the galleries
(be it in Tower or Downtown,)
there isn't much left there in terms of snacks, water, juice, (whatever,) and it's actualy a nice surprise when somebody still has something there for us. (Sorry, but that's just the truth.)

-That's fine with us,
-We're not there for the food and free drinks, (again, there often aren't any,)
We're there for checking out the art, talking with the artists, riding as a group with each other (and discussing the art together,) --then heading to the next venue.
(ArtHop on Bikes, get it?)

If people want to put out munchies and stuff,
-'but they only want those who are going to stay longer, hand out business cards, and start asking a bunch of questions about the artwork, (in an overture to buy the work,')
--They should make it clear, (sort of how some people put up signs in businesses for use of the bathrooms, I suppose.
'...Food and Wine for buyers and those who like this artists work only..' (or) '...for the slow moving and non-sweaty...'

PS:
I personally, (as a bikehopper?,)
HAVE bought things while 'on the hop,' --They're usually small, but okay, shoot me, I'm on a bike,,,

-and (again,) if I'm in a place?
-they have stuff to eat and drink?
I'll take a nibble, maybe a brief glass, look around,
-but if there is nothing intersting?
I'm out of there.
-That's life.

If folks want me to spend more time looking at their work?,
it needs to be something I'm interested in, worth spending more time with (as the time is limited.)

I've gotten celphone numbers,
business cards,
Email addresses,
and such
-ALL from seeing really good work at BikeHop,
--am intending to buy some works (again funds permitting,)
-and (again,) wouldn't ever have known who these folks were were it not for Art(Bike)Hop.

So, yeah, ArtHop works, and BikeHop works.

Now, I'm discerning, I'm an artist and an artisan, So, I have strong feelings and reasons for what I like and dislike,
but am quite fair-handed,
and try to be encouraging (at least,) when I see someone really making an effort as an artist.
(And will continue to do so,) even if I'm not into their stuff.

--But people in general know when they are seeing something good, and when they're not,
(you don't need an education for that,)

--I've stood amidst a lot of folks here in town, and felt the vibe, when an artist has really put out some great stuff,
(and that's soooo cool.)

-I've also been part of groups who walk in, look around, and say,
'...okay, time to move on and see what else is going on.'

-that's because NOTHING grabbed them, (and that's simply the facts of life as an artist.)

My advice?
Do good stuff: people will want to see it and know about it.

Don't?
They'll probably be polite follow the rule of '..if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything,' and jet.

--but at least they gave it a shot.

There are no set rules that because something has been done, that it has to be seen as worth paying attention to.

-Now, If somebody from BikeHop walked into your show, unzipped and took a leak on it? Yeah, THAT's a problem, and is not acceptable.

(but honestly? I've never even heard the group mutter '...this is CRAP...' when standing in front of work that was less than great... It's simply not that sort of crowd, Most of us are in the arts to begin with, we all have local friends who are in the arts, and we'er supportive of the arts, ('good' or 'bad,') it's one of the reasons why I rode with them from the start.
(We sweat sometimes, but we're at least polite and open to checking out new stuff.)

As far as Jinaka closing?

Serious bummer.

They always had excellent shows, I've almost always (personally,) enjoyed what they were hanging,
they made it a POINT to get good work in there,
(and presented it very well,,, Instead of crowding the works, they gave a lot of breathing room per piece, and they didn't have to do that... this place was a class act.)

---AND?,
-they almost always had eats and drinks for us -and we'd usually get there later,
-they'd welcome us (sweaty, helmetted and all,) with a smile
(not even knowing that some of us us knew just as much about the arts, if not sometimes more than they did.)
-They're really nice folks.
I'm going to miss them, and appreciate the work that they have done, and the standard that they set.

This was a top-quality stop, every single time, and I can honestly tell you, each BikeHop, the riders wanted to check it out, EVERY time, (food, drinks, or not.)

Jinaka? Thanks.
Ed? Good luck.

this is too bad, because i really thought that jinnaka was a really nice venue, easy to find, and was one that i always recommmended to people. and, i hoped that some day i'd score some sort of show there. but oh well.

"This whole situation is sad, and echos sentiments we've heard from other artists, who say ArtHop has become less about art and more about the social gathering (ie. hipsters hanging out and being seen)."

i wouldn't just say that it's the fault of the hipsters hanging out and trying to be seen. i'd say that "being seen" is important to many groups. i've seen plenty of yuppies, nouveaux riche, movers & shakers, whoever just milling about at art hop stops, talking loudly, not looking @ the art and even consuming wine.

i'm hoping that the trend doesn't continue, because as an artist, as small time as i am, i'm trying to get my art out there, and yes, sell pieces. if you're just coming to be seen (well, you're probably not @ my shows but anyway), then you're not helping my trade that much. i say that much because everyone that comes in the doors helps a little.

and, as a venue, it's a difficult call on serving alcohol. the fresno arts council says that the venue is responsible for making sure that people are of age to get served. which makes sense, but unless you have a server there it's difficult to enforce. most stops have a serve yourself policy, and then it's all honor system. i don't think i attended art hop when i was still underage, but i might have. i'm pretty sure it wouldn't have stopped me from having "a" glass unless someone asked.

and, i've had shows where people seemed to just come in for the wine. really, i'm not bashing any particular group, but i know that during at least one of the shows i had @ salon 637 (now defunct), a large group of people arrived (they were sweaty like maybe they'd been biking), made a b-line for the wine, filled up glasses and were back out the door. maybe they glanced @ my stuff on the way in or out.

who are these wicked hipsters, anyway?