Fresno Famous

what???

...my god man, I can't believe you just said that, that was so kind... (good thing I'll never be able to focus, and yes, I like your stuff too... (If I ever have a shot at Ivanka, I promise I'll put in a good word for you... (oh wait, Mrs. Wiffle will kill me, won't she..)

and I suck???!

First you call me by my old name (RomeoVoid,)
But then R.V.???
(which as we know is short of Recreational Vehicle... -dood, I know I've been hitting the donuts a bit hard lately,,,
--but Recreational Freakin' Vehicle?
(...These pants are looser than before, bro... (no wait, that didn't come out the way it was intended...)

Okay, Game On...

... back to the water attraction.

RV truce?

Romeo Void. Thank you sir.

We've managed to stay out of each others hair for sometime, both taking the higher road and what not...don't know what else to say about that...I enjoy your posts (when I have the time to read them), and know if you could focus your writing energy, you'd be the best writer here. You have talent I'll never have.

....wait...being friends is boring...YOU SUCK RV! SUCK HARD!

Now, back to defaming Fresno's goverment: HEY, MAYOR BUBBA! GO GET A MOP AND CLEAN THAT FOUNTAIN UP! AND GET YOUR SHINE BOX WHILE YOU'RE AT IT!

Dear Wiffle

It's true in the past that you and I have not been exactly simpatico.
And most of the time I read your posts, (such as the invitation for someone to service the needs of Ivanka Trump on her recent 'fact finding tour,' of Fresno to be vulgar, distasteful, godzilla-hormonal, and (yes, I'll admit,) very funny.
(I nearly wrote back '...well, big fella, you got the nards to care, grab a bunch of daisey's and make us proud...'
-but you'd have thought I was mocking you, (I wouldn't be, in fact, I think you landing a mermaid like Ivanka would be quite the feat...)
---I also realized that there was a Mrs. Wiffle as well, so I figured I'd steer clear of that whole thing, and let your battle cry go off into the horizon and be answered by somebody else...

Then I just read your rather passionate postings about the fountain.

Dude...
Straight up...

If I could do it right now?
I'd go down and clean that sucker withn an inch of its life, and then say you did it.

As you know, I'm not a Fresnan.
I can't care about Fresno as Fresnans do, -because I come from a place far-far away, miss it very much, -and (even though it's still home? ) It's got major issues too.

But your caring and statement, which was a gut level straight out plea and declaration for the town that you love, is quite moving.
Without it sounding corny... I am glad that there are folks who care about this place such as you... You are a key part of Fresno's soul, (perhaps a bit brash at times, ---but as someone who likes such in-elegant arts as Dirt Car Racing (okay, even school busses on dirt,) I can appreciate the grit in my teeth at the end of the post.)

You've redeemed yourself sir...

In my book?

You're okay.

---If I can offer this one piece of solace? (from the bottom of my heart?)
No.
Fresno is not going to be left like it is.
They are not going to go after some stupid new project just to leave the rest of it languish like a half built cow, now lying as roadkill..
-There are too many people who will not put up with that nonsense anymore, (some of which have plenty of money and can do what they want,)
---and there are citizens such as yourself, who, when at the keys? Inspire people to really care and really do something.

Take heart.
Nobody is going to love Fresno like a true Fresnan.
But a LOT of us like Fresno for our own reasons,

-And I promise you, if only for the sheer hell of it,
We're not gonna let it die.

-Sincerely

E. Field
NY Transplant

Former Adversary of Wiffle...

(truce shall last for 25 seconds...)

...unkay...

done..!

'...Everybody...? wiffle bites tub bubbles...!'

(..okay, sorry, just kidding...
-Had to do something to cheer you up...

besides... I just didn't want freakin' HallMark or Ron freakin' Howard eyeing this string up to make it into some sappy tear jerker...)

"lights out'

I don't blame people at all for being afraid to walk down the mall at night. It may be the most deserted place on earth, but it still isn't the smartest place to be walking by oneself at night. There just isn't enough light to completely see your surroundings. A lady (i think) on FresnoFusion.com made a good point about there being a lot of places to hide if your a mugger. Even if her fears are unfounded, why should she walk down the mall and feel totally uncomfortable.

The city should consider the light issue a safety issue. Even if it just helps put people at ease. It definitely couldn't hurt.

Aside from safety, i think it would help draw more people down the mall after the games. But then again for what, nothing is open. But on the other side of that coin, maybe stores would be open if more people walked the mall. Its a vicious cycle.

Personally, I say (to the mayor) show me we can maintain what we have now, before you add a "river" to the maintenance issues of downtown.

This is just freakin' tragic

How does the city let this go on? Everybody is telling the city to do something with the mall...anything...and they do nothing, nothing, nothing, and that trashed fountain says it all.

Here is Joe, trying to get the city to listen, posting on Fresno's #1 site, and is anybody going to do...anything? Is anybody listening? After this picture gets posted, there should be somebody busting heads and making sure that fountain is sparkling by Tuesday afternoon...but it won't be.

JEEEZZZZ FRESNO GOVERMENT IDIOTS, CAN'T YOU EVEN KEEP FULTON CLEAN? JUST KEEP IT CLEAN. OBVIOUSLY, YOU DON'T HAVE THE ENERGY TO ACTUALLY DO SOMETHING (NEW) WITH THE MALL, SO JUST KEEP IT CLEAN AND WE'LL WAIT AROUND FOR SOME PRIVATE INVESTORS TO REVIVE IT OR WHATEVER.

AND IF YOU HAVE ANOTHER MEETING (THAT YOU'LL RESCHEDULE FOR FUTHER STUDY) OR CREATE SOME BULLSHIT TASK FORCE, OR LOOK INTO FIXING IT, GET SOMEBODY ON THAT, ASK US AGAIN IF WE WANT IT OPEN FOR TRAFFIC OR....I don't know what to do with you people. What does it matter anymore if it's open for traffic...at least it would be a change.

I mean, should I feel guilty that I'm not down there cleaning it up myself? Is it my duty as a Fresnan to keep Fulton Mall clean or to have a working lighting system? Is it?

Do you think if one of the Fulton Mall tenants was a Wall Mart or Bass Pro you'd let this kind of ugliness go on in the Fulton Mall? No, you wouldn't. But, because the tenants are businesses like the Goodwill Store and Fruit vendors, YOU DON'T GIVE A SHIT!

Re: Downtown Fountain disaster

Here's another shot, so you can see where to look for it, when you go out to see Fulton Plaza Thursdays this Thursday:

I dunno guys...

I hope they get it fixed soon,

-but next time I'm walkin' next to that 'fountain,' you just posted, I'm gonna throw in one of those big pink 'bowl freshnin mints' just to try to help things out...

(Had I known that we had fountains like this, I'd a driven a 'Jersey Shore DDT Skeeter Control Truck'
back from home last time I went...
(..yes, we did have those down the shore in the 60's and 70's...)

-we used to also pour waste oil on the swamps to kill the mosquito larvae too... (It worked...)
-killed dang near everything else, but the oil had this strange effect:
-'fore too long we had these big ol' Fonzy lookin' Greezer Mosquitos buzzing around, wearing itty bitty engineer boots riding these tiny harley-davidsons...

(-them 'natural selection-adaptation-evolution boys just loved that.)

(Come to think of it, those DDT trucks had more room than the two flights I usually need to take...
-remind me this Chrismas, I'll see what I can do.)

Downtown fountain disaster

I've seen the fountain work crews too. I usually park in the underground garage and walk down the mall the the Grizzlies games. They were working on the ones in front of the Patterson Building not that long ago.

Re: burned out bulbs - if there are so many burned out bulbs (there are) that the fountain crews can't find the fountains (not an unreasonable theory) should we be surprised that people say they don't feel safe walking down the mall at night? I don't think it's unsafe, but I can see how people would think that. Maybe the solution would be to replace the bulbs? Actually an entirely new lighting system would be nice. The entire area should we well lit.

fountains

I have seen crews working on the fountains the last couple of times I've gone to the mall. But it definitely looks like that one has been ignored for some time. I've also noticed the maintenance crews only work at night, which is odd considering the amount of lamp posts that have burnt out bulbs or just don't operate at all. Maybe that is why they don't know what is in need of repair, they cant see anything out there.

...jeez, Joe..

thanks for posting pictures of urinals...
--I was just eating dinner over here... (blecch..)

Downtown river preview, part II?

Seen on the Fulton Mall at Mariposa Street, Saturday morning July 28th 2007. This "fountain" (it used to be a fountain) is near the west entrance to the Mariposa Street part of the Fulton Mall, right next to the "Executive Plaza" building. I had never noticed it before, despite walking past it dozens of times. Apparently those responsible for its maintenance have forgotten about it as well! Thank goodness our current downtown water features are being put to such good use that we need to turn Kern Street into a faux river. I didn't check to see if there were any mosquito larvae present, but I wouldn't be surprised given the stagnant green water. Will the downtown river look like this? If no, why is that? And why can't we maintain our existing downtown water features?

I'm glad someone said it.

Well stated. You hit the nail on the head. Fresno's inept leadership is once again wasting time and limited resources on stupid ideas that will produce little if any benefit for the city. It's a shame Fresnans can't find better representation. Craig should run again.

Canal is crusty looking

When I saw the debate on Valley Press the other night I was amazed at how crusty the Mayor looked. And the picture of the proposed 'river' looked the same. It was just a small canal at street level running down the middle of Kern street. I thought about the wind-blown trash floating in the water as the panhandlers hit up the folks riding by in the fake little 'kiddie-ride' gondolas.

The pic from the mall with trash in the water hits it right on the head.

When Paul made the post about the California's Gold episode where Huell Howser was at the Downtown River in San Jose (which is natural and quite beautiful) I envisioned a similar meandering, realistic looking river surrounded by a natural looking park 20 feet below street level and a block wide. The Mayor's proposal is nothing of the sort. Where is that artists rendering the Mayor used?

Craig's thoughtful argument totally turned me around on the whole idea. He pointed out so many other more important issues that need to be addressed to revitalize downtown. And this canal proposal just gets in the way of actually solving the problems.

Count me in the small group

Count me in the small group of those who think a downtown river would be...well...neat...sorta.

But Joe's right here...and I'll see that photo of the Fulton fountains and raise you a trip to the Roeding Park "lake" - which is beyond disrepair. I dunno what caused the state its in, but I know that even though they won't say why, those paddleboats are closed because the health dept would shut 'em down if they even TRIED to open.

There's a lot that needs to be done to downtown, that the city should take the responsibility to do, before we go digging any ditches.

Great Idea

I like the idea of buying the buildings and giving it to a developer with the requirement to convert them into lofts. Is it possible to force the owners to sell? I would hope so in some way. Your plan would be cheaper then the River Walk and has better long term benefit as well.

Downtown River

The point here is this: Almost everything Mayor Autry says about the River Walk project today in 2007 was said back in 1962 and 1963 when they were planning the Fulton Mall. Almost word for word. They said the same things about the convention center and the downtown ballpark too. All of them are nice, but all of them have failed to do the things their proponents said they would do. They were all the "big bang" projects of their day. Yet today in 2007, we're still having a debate about spending over $60 million to do the same thing and make the same mistakes all over again:

1) Betting on one or two projects instead of lots of smaller ones, thinking of projects and not revitalization
2) Closing more streets, cutting off more foot and vehicle traffic
3) Trying to take the "urban" out of the urban environment, suburbanizing downtown
4) Ignoring our real authentic assets for phony Disney-like attractions
5) Not realizing what makes a downtown environment special and unique

If the City really is dedicated on doing a "big bang project" here's a suggestion: buy the JC Penneys and Bank of Italy buildings from Galaxy Partners, who have bailed on their plans to develop those historic high rise buildings. No matter how much the city spends on a river or lake, as long as those buildings sit empty and decay, in sight of everyone at the stadium, and everyone walking down the mall, people will have a negative view of downtown. They're key properties. Even if nothing else changed from what we have today, if those two buildings were alive 24/7 with hundreds of residents, our entire preception of what downtown is would change.

Buying the properties might cost $10-$25 million. Then open up bids to other developers to convert them to lofts, with retail on the ground floors. Then GIVE the winning developer the buildings, WITH the condition that they have to follow through on the plan as set forth by a certain timeline, or the city regains ownership. You could do all of that for less than the River Walk plan, and all of a sudden over a year or two, you have turned around the key intersection in Fresno. How is that? Well, the development density at Tulare and Fulton is higher at that corner than anywhere else in downtown. Three major multi story buildings on three of the four corners. No other downtown intersection is as dense. And you need density to support businesses. Getting residents followed by retail around the stadium and the mall will change everything. AND unlike a River Walk, these buildings will generate property tax revenue! I'm sure there's problems with a plan like this, but I think it's worth a look. Maybe the city can just subsidize a part of the renovation costs of the buildings, again, with conditions. Other cities do this. Why not Fresno?

I agree but...

I agree that the current upkeep needs a shot in the arm.

But couldn't the proposal including a budget for funding the additional upkeep of the new water feature?

There are lots of weeds and garbage in the dividers of many roads in Fresno. When a new road is laid or proposed, I don't hear a lot of people saying no because it could, possibly lead to more weeds/garbage.

got it

and i agree. That is a great issue to bring up to the city council. With pictures and all. What will be in place to make sure that this doesn't happen again?

I think the council did ask how much it was going to cost to maintain. But the mayors staff didn't have any numbers.

I also wonder what will happen to the "river" during severe drought years. Will they let it go dry? I've heard of that being done to the fountains in the mall.

Then the mayor can compare us to Tucson and their dry river.

on and on we go...

It's a stupid idea, the city can't even maintain the fountains on the Fulton mall how will they ever maintain a river downtown. I've been saying this since I first read about the fake downtown river idea, until the Fountain in front of the Bank of Italy building is restored from it's current life as a planter, a fake man made river in downtown does not belong here, save the money a put it to making the San Joaquin river as a nice riverside park, with bicycle and hiking trails.

Downtown River preview?

I'm not sure that Fulton Mall patrons are any more or less messy than shoppers in other parts of Fresno. My point is if the City is going to talk about the need for "big bang" water features, they might have more credibility if they were doing a good job of keeping up the ones they already have. If the fake lake/river is 200x bigger than this little fountain, can we expect the trash problem to be 200x worse?

any day of the week

The state of disrepair of the mall is just this side of disgusting. You cant walk down the mall with out seeing leaking water faucets or trash strewn about.

I think some of the fault should lie on the patrons of the mall. I have seen first hand people throw their trash in a flower bed when a trash can was within arms distance. I kid you not, arms length!

I think a full time maintenance crew would do a world of good for the mall.

okay.

yeah. i figured it was recent, just thought i'd ask. i've seen trash in the fountains, or others that were dry or in disrepair, but also know that the city has been trying to really work on this. so, i just figured i would ask.

Trash in the fountains

It was Friday June 22nd, 2007. Right before I walked down to see Patrick Contreras at Arte Americas.

date?

out of curiosity, when did you take that photo? not accusing you of anything, but that photo could be really old. or, perhaps just snapped on a day when it was windy and trash was a flyin'